Episode 9
· 36:56
I am here with Olivia Rafferty, and we are gonna talk about all the cool stuff that you've had been going on. And one of those big cool things, I mean, you quit Spotify. Yeah. A lot of peep a lot of people love talking about that. It's, like, such an anomaly.
Seth:That's such a wild thing. Can you can you talk a little bit about that?
Olivia:Yeah. I mean, it's funny because I think well, not to be this person, but I was talking about this a year ago. And then also, pardon, like, it kind of, like, came around, I think, after this whole, like, discovery that they were doing a lot of stuff in house, and then there's a whole problem with, like, AI random songs being put on playlists and stuff with, like, the Yep. The variation on the flute in the have you heard, like, the flute in the drum song where it's like,
Seth:Oh, I've I have.
Olivia:Like okay. So there's, like, a lot of stuff like that going on. But for me, like, the main reason that I wanted to, like, quit Spotify was because I just felt like I wasn't kinda just, like, putting my money where my mouth was and, like, my values as an artist, you know, asking people to buy my album. And it was like, okay, girl. You you give them Spotlight ten minutes a month.
Olivia:Like, you're not buying anyone's albums right now. So I I wanted to kind of rectify that, you know, and just, like, go ahead and yeah. Just just, like, do do something. And I think it's hard for, like, artists to like, of course, my music is still on Spotify. You know?
Olivia:And, like, I've it's I sort of see it as, a marketing tool now more than anything else. And, like, people will still listen to music on Spotify, and I don't vilify those people. Like, you know, to be honest, like, since I have quit Spotify, I might, like, breadth of my music consumption has gone, like, way down, which I guess is, like, sort of just one of the natural effects of that. For example, you know, you're not, like, discovering and adding loads of stuff to playlists all the time. Like, oh my god.
Olivia:Give me all the music. Like, you know? But I can't even remember where I was going with this. But, I mean, the the the point is it's just it it's not a bad thing to use, Spotify. Like, it it's not.
Olivia:It's you know, I don't think you can move in this planet without interacting and touching and giving a company money whose values ultimately you actually don't agree with. But it was, like, the it it was just one thing that I wanted to do.
Seth:Yeah. Yeah. And and I see definitely in the comments, there was there was a lot of people saying like, oh, I want to do this, but I just can't. Yeah. Yeah.
Seth:It's it's so, like, I mean, it's kinda in my world. I wanna quit social media, but I can't. And Yeah. It's such a wild concept that there's such, like, lock in of these companies that, like, just keep us like, yeah, it's hard getting off like like you said, you're not listening to as much music anymore. But you know?
Seth:And and on social media, sure. I miss out on all this other stuff, like maybe the flute song or whatever the heck that you're talking about. But but yeah. Can you speak to that? Like, I mean because because, again, in the in the comments of of your post, it was like, well well, how do I find new music?
Seth:Where will I ever find new music again?
Olivia:Yeah. You you like adopt new habits. I mean, one of the you you start to realize sort of, like, where those places are in your life where you would be listening to music and using Spotify and stuff, and maybe it's the same with social media as well. For me, I was kind of, like, the office DJ at my work, and so I would be the one who's, like, connected to Bluetooth speaker and just, like, put something on Spotify and just queue up loads of songs throughout the day. And instead, I was like, okay.
Olivia:You know, no one else is really stepping up to play it. I still wanna listen to music at work. And so I started, like, experimenting with, like, different radio stations and stuff. And so now it's, like, my office, we listen to, like, NPR the current, for example, or, like, KEXP or something. And then every so often, like, you'll just, like, get this song and you're like, oh my god.
Olivia:What is that? And so I now have, like, an like, a list on my notes app, which feels like, you know, a lot more I don't know. Like, there is no, like, perfectly beautiful, most organic way to, like, discover new music, for example. But it it does feel kind of exciting when you're like, oh, I wanna put that one down here, and then I can come and, like, check it out later and see if I do like it or not. You know?
Olivia:So, like, in terms of music discovery, like, you you will do like, you will probably discover less music if you're not, like, replacing, I don't know, like, the amount of time you listen to spot Spotify to, like, searching for new music, for example. But, like, radio stations are a great way. Like, you know, friends, like, recommendations. Like, people on Substack who, like, have playlists and recommend artists and things as well. You know?
Olivia:To, like, the people that say they they wanna do it, but they can't. Like, I also thought, you know, I have all these playlists. I literally, like I think I downloaded Spotify in '20 it was, like, just when I went to university. So it was 02/2009, and that's when it kinda, like, really hit, I think. And from 2012 onwards, I started to make a playlist for, like, every month of the year.
Olivia:And so I literally have this catalog of playlist from, like, December 2012 until when I quit, which was, like, December 2023.
Seth:Wow. Yeah.
Olivia:Which is, like, every song that I ever thought would be, like, my favorite. It goes into every month. So if you were like, oh, what were you listening to? Like, March, you know, 2019? I could be like, well, I'll tell you exactly what I'm listening to.
Olivia:You know? And it was kinda sad to say goodbye to all those playlists, and every so often, I do go back because I have to do something with, like, with my own artist profile or something on Spotify, and I'll I'll kind of go in and have a look. And I'm like, oh my god. I love all these songs. And I think one day, like, I would like to slowly, like, build back up my collection, and I kind of did that.
Olivia:I was like, there are some albums that I know I definitely want. But also, you know, like, I I guess it feels sad to, like, listen to less of, like, a breadth of music. Like and it's not kind of the same with social media, whereas with social media, you're just consuming loads of crap, like, basically. Like, you know, you're like, you're you're you're not like, oh, my favorite reels, you know, whereas with, like, music, it's kinda different. But I honestly just think, like, I I I I wrote those posts to, like, share my experience and maybe, like, I'll write another one at some point.
Olivia:Because now I'm kind of like, wow, Olivia. You really have been listening to, like, the same Lady Gaga album for, like, three months straight. You know? But it's fine. It's part of the experience, you know.
Seth:Yeah. Do you have you dabbled much? I I see a little bit that you wrote about, but, like, physical CDs or physical meat?
Olivia:I I haven't got a disk drive, but this new sort of, like, MacBook edition, which is kind of is really annoying because I I, like, you know, do, like, sort of, like, thrift shopping a lot when you go to these charity shops in The UK, there's just, like, CDs on CDs on CDs.
Seth:Oh, yeah.
Olivia:What kind of quality they're in? I don't know. You know, you might get something that's like, but, like, you could definitely pick stuff up. To be honest, like, I have this, like, really beautiful, like, boombox tape deck that I bought back in the pandemic that I recorded some songs on, and I started buying cassettes as well. It it needs repair now because every time I play anything, it slows everything.
Olivia:Like, everything gets slower and slower and slower and slower until it's like it just sounds like some going, ugh.
Seth:So Well, that's no fun.
Olivia:That we need to repair that. But, like, I I I definitely like collecting cassette tapes is some like, I definitely am kinda like, oh, gotta pick this one up. Gotta pick this one up. So I do enjoy that as well. It's really nice.
Olivia:I mean, there was definitely a phase, like, last year when my boombox was working where, you know, I'd be sitting, working at my desk, put on ABBA, and it would, like you know, and then you flip the side and stuff, like, you know, like, all that old cassette stuff. You know? And it was really nice. And I think also it was kind of, like, a bonus for, you know, being focused, maybe not, like, going on social media or scrolling if you're, like, working on something because anything, like, extra which gets you to, like, check your computer to do something or use your computer to do something, it does, like, give you an invitation to, like, enter the wormhole. So being able to, like like, listen to music, like, in physical media or something not attached to your phone or your computer is really great.
Seth:Yeah. Yeah. I have a CD player here that I bought a couple years ago around the pandemic for the same thing, just to have something with real speakers, just to have something I could put a CD into. Mm-mm. I do run the, you know, the aux jack into it, you know, from my computer and listen to music that way a little bit.
Seth:But but having physical things to play your music on is so great.
Olivia:It is. Yeah. And it really, like, you know it's funny because I feel like all of us probably have, like, some I don't know. Maybe not all of us, but, like, most people here maybe might have some kind of, like, emotional connection to, like, certain music players, you know, that, like Mhmm. I always remember, like, my dad had this hi fi, like, little thing, which was, like, it could play tapes, it could play CDs, and mini discs, which was like Woah.
Seth:Mini discs.
Olivia:Woah. Yeah. Yeah. Which was like a flash in the pan, but looked very cool. We had I think he burned David Bowie's album Heathen to mini disc, and we had, like, a little hand like a like a Portugal mini disc player as well.
Seth:Oh, Bose. I always wanted one of those. Yeah.
Olivia:Yeah. And they were
Seth:because they didn't skip. Right?
Olivia:Yeah. I think that was probably, like the the size and the, like, unskippability was, like, the lure of it. You know? Yeah. And they also don't look cool.
Olivia:They looked so cool.
Seth:They looked so cool. Yeah.
Olivia:Yeah.
Seth:About vinyl?
Olivia:Vinyl, I don't have a vinyl player at the moment, and I don't, like, have a collection. I I have records, but I've given them to my friend who does have a record player to, like, keep, blah, safe for me, basically. So I but when I was, like, in when when I was in uni, like, over ten years ago, my dad, one Christmas, gave me, like, a really cheap record player and then also gifted me, like, the vinyl that he had sitting in his house that he wasn't, like, listening to because he didn't really have, like, a vinyl set up there at the moment. So, like, I got all of his like, him and mom's record collection combined, which was, like, Prince, Bruce Springsteen, Van Morrison, Talking Blinds. Like, just, like, oh, it was so good.
Olivia:So it was just so great. So I really, you know I love that because I could, like, get up in the morning, and then I would I had, like, this room in this, like, old Georgian house, which just had, like, like, old fireplace, which wasn't in use anymore in one side of the room. And so it was, like, a big mantelpiece in this, like, tiled section in front of the fireplace, and that's where I had the vinyl player. And I'd, like, put on a record to get ready in the morning, you know, and then you can kinda, like, get ready in the time it takes for, like, side one or, like, the whole record to, like, be over and done with. So yeah.
Olivia:I I I don't have, like, records here. I have records somewhere, and it will be, like, you know, old records where my parents pass on. It's like, the records will come to me.
Seth:Yeah. Oh, that's yeah. Growing up, my parents had a a music room where you listen to the music. You only listen to it where the headphones could reach, you know, there were the two speakers and, you know, a wall full of records and stuff. Yeah.
Seth:Yeah. So, yeah, there's definitely an emotional connection to, like, the physical players and and the physical pieces that you hold in your hands.
Olivia:Yeah. I I don't think I never actually thought about it, like, until now, but it's, like, definitely, I can, like, remember, like, certain, like, CD players tape like, cassette players, radios, and stuff, which, like, you know, you grew up with and you use and stuff.
Seth:Do you remember your first CD?
Olivia:I think, like, I don't know because I I I think I remember the first one I bought for myself, but before then, I was, like, metal peeping them as, like, gifts and stuff, like, you know. And for me, it was, like, like, now that's why I call music, particularly, like, now '44, like Mhmm. Chad, like, Britney Spears hit oops. I did it again. And, like, Eiffel 64 Blue, which is the best song ever.
Olivia:They had that song on it and, like, Backstreet Boys and stuff. And we had Steps, which is like a UK pop band with massive, massive, massive Steps fan as a kid, like, knew all the dances and what have you. So those were, like, my records. I remember getting a Venga Boys CD, one birthday, and an a one, which is, like, another boy band from The UK in the nineties with, like, curtain bangs and stuff. I I think the yeah.
Olivia:I think the first thing I bought for myself, which is always like, you know, you never wanna really tell anyone unless you have a really cool, like, first record. I think mine was like, don't lie by the black eyed peas. Okay. Alright. I'm like, it's still a bagger.
Olivia:But it was so funny because it's really not like a I you know, people want, like, their first, like, thing they get to be, like, emblematic of, like, who they are as a person, you know. So it it it wasn't exactly that. What what was your first, like, CD or record or tape tape that you bought for yourself?
Seth:My first CD that I got for the CD player that I got for Christmas as a kid, the CD was Alice in Chains facelift, which is a banger.
Olivia:And that's that's cool. That's a cool It's a purchase.
Seth:Good. But but, I mean, really, like, I only knew you know, it was it was a MTV band at the time. So it was, like Yeah. Kinda kinda par for course. First CD I bought for myself was Into Another Ignarus.
Seth:It's, like, kinda post hard metal band from
Olivia:Yeah. I don't know
Seth:that one. Yeah. That's a a lot of people don't know that. But my buddy Mimi took me to from my first hardcore show ever, took me to see them. She was a big she still is a big into another fan.
Seth:And my first, like growing up, I went to, like, concert concerts, like, where you went to the the ticket booth and you bought the tickets and the fur I mean, this was a ticketed show too, but, like, the first real, like, underground hardcore show I went to was Into Another with Biohazard and Life of Agony during The River Runs Red to like, this '94, '90 '5 or so. I was I was so scared. I was scared.
Olivia:I would be sick. Remember the Terrified. Oh, I remember the first show I went to where I was like, shit. I need, like, ear protection. I seriously need ear protection, you know, or or, like, when you have, like, a mosh pit or something.
Olivia:Mhmm. And I think what was that? I went to a show and it was like who was support? It was like, I think I went to like a Billy Talent concert, a cancer bat supporting. And I was just standing at the edge going, I don't like tooth.
Olivia:I don't really get it. And it was like windmilling their own arm.
Seth:I still don't like it. Yeah.
Olivia:So it's Totally. It's intense. But you kinda feel like you need to participate, but at the same time, you're like, I don't wanna get hit in the head. Because, like, I think I always think with moshing, it looks like everyone's, you know, there to, like, help each other and run around. But, like, if you get hit in the head, it doesn't really hurt, but I think it would really hurt to get hit in the head.
Seth:I don't wanna get hit in the head. No. Yeah. No. No.
Seth:Let's talk about your new album Yeah. Which is not a Mash appropriate album. No. But it but it but it does rock.
Olivia:It's rough.
Seth:It does rock. Tell tell us about that rock, geology theme to it.
Olivia:Yeah. So it's a concept album about geology, and I guess, like, it's sort of more I'm influenced kind of, like, by Americana sort of music and also kind of, like, indie folk. Like, a lot of these kind of, like, New York two thousands artists like Regina Spector and stuff and things like that. And, like, people who kind of, like, observe interesting things and turn them into songs. I was like David Byrd and, like, Jens Lakeman and stuff like that as well.
Olivia:So it's basically a concept album about rocks, but it I never really wanted to write an album which was like, this rock is called granite, and it is got feldspar and mica. And, you know, like, I didn't want to do, like, an educational album. Like, the main point was over the pandemic, I discovered geology. I, like, started watching all these lectures. I got really into it, and I was just like, wow.
Olivia:There's so much going on, like, on the planet and inside the planet, which, like, we don't actually know about. Like, you wouldn't know about unless you, like, concentrated really hard in geography class or you went off and did, like, an earth science course after school or whatever. And I just really wanted to share that with people, but in a way that the average, like, the every man would understand, you know, and, like, what what is, like, what is songwriting, you know, more able to do than other things than to, like, give people, like, an instant emotional connection to things and really speak to, like, people's emotions and, like, you know, relationships with other people and relationships with themselves. And so that's the kind of lens that I looked through when it came to writing these songs about geology. So, you know, they are about earthquakes and fossils and, like, tectonic plates, but they're also about, like, love and loss and nostalgia and memory and, like, changing as a person, growing older and changing and stuff.
Olivia:So it's been an amazing project. Like, I started working on it. I started writing the songs, like, in 2022, which is when I started my newsletter as well. It was for that reason that I kind of, like, started on Substack. And I've just released it on the March 7, so that's, like, almost, like, two weeks ago, like, a week and a half ago now, and it's out there.
Olivia:Like
Seth:It it is out there. It. Absolutely. Available on Bandcamp for sure. The link is on your newsletter for sure and other places, but whatever.
Seth:How's how's the response been to it?
Olivia:It's been really great. Like Cool. Honestly, I think it kinda hit me when I was packing up my like, in addressing my Kickstarter rewards the other day. And I was, like, writing the names of people that I didn't even know and, like, sending I'm like, this one's going to Belgium. This one's going to The Netherlands.
Olivia:This one's going to America and Canada. Like, it was pretty amazing to see, like, how far the music like, how like, to be honest, like, as much as we gripe about music and stuff, like, Internet like, sorry, about the Internet. The Internet has enabled me to really, like, send this album far and wide and just kind of, like, reach a lot of people and, like, excite a lot of people and stuff, which has been so nice. So it's yeah.
Seth:Prime how did you primarily promote the Kickstarter and all that? Was it through the newsletter? Was there some element of social media with it?
Olivia:There is constant like, every day I would post to Instagram, and I think, like, in the lead up to it, I did, like a, like, post every day for, like, the four or five days leading up, maybe one post a week before. I also created, like, a separate stem of, like, newsletter through kit or convert kit as it was. Yeah. And kind of was, like said to my followers, I was, like well, my subscribers, I was, like, if this is annoying you, you can actually unsubscribe from this portion of the, like, you know, newsletter outgoings and stuff because I had, like, my sub sec, and I would post there weekly and kinda do, like, in-depth. I kind of I did, like, a series where I kinda wanted to tell the story of, like, all the music I'd made up until this point, And so that would kinda, like, show the significance of what I was doing now.
Olivia:And I also then in the, like, the kit newsletters, which we went out, like, every other day, and it's funny because I think my boyfriend's mom at the time was like, Olivia needs to stop sending so many newslettes to stop getting really annoyed. I had like, just that'll do this. Let me do this. And I was like, I think I was in the mindset of like, I am going to annoy people and I genuinely don't care at this point because, you know what, It it got me, like, a thousand over the bar at the end of the day when it came to the Kickstarter money. Like, it's Thousand pounds.
Olivia:Me there. A thousand pounds.
Seth:Oh, okay. Wow.
Olivia:Yeah. Yeah. Like, we we went over I mean, I was modest with the goal, but we went over it by a thousand pounds, which was really, really great. So, like, people didn't, like, slow down when they saw that we'd kind of reached the target.
Seth:And and so often, yeah, to your point of, like, well, oh, I'm gonna send a bunch of emails and everyone's gonna be mad. This, that like, not everybody sees every email that you send. They Oh, not just you, but everybody. Yeah.
Olivia:Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I'm so many people go to my junk nowadays. Like, it's really disconcerting. And, you know, also, like, I'm trying to, like, do my inbox zero, like, once a week or something, and I'm like, yeah.
Olivia:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, we we don't always have time to open every newsletter, but it is that thing where it's kind of like, what do they say?
Olivia:You need to expose someone to something about seven times before they actually will, like, engage with it. And that's kind of, like, the mindset that I've really tried to have had when it comes to, like, marketing the music and stuff. I'm like, okay. Even though this feels weird, nobody is realizing that I'm posting about this as much as I am. Nope.
Olivia:Or people that pay way too much attention feel like my mom, you know, like and everyone else is fine. Like, it it it doesn't matter. So yeah.
Seth:Yeah. I always just stress that on social media too. You've probably seen me write about that. Like, you can't just tweet about your thing on Monday. I don't think anyone's that's solid.
Seth:Like, you've gotta post, you know, if you're still on social media, you know, to post it daily, different times to accommodate for different time zones, maybe.
Olivia:Yeah. And in, like, different ways as well, like, formats and stuff to just, like, engage with people differently. And it's, like, it is so funny because the amount of like, for example, one person who has, like, been a big fan of me, she's, like, a geoscience communicator and stuff. She's absolutely amazing. And the other day, like, I hadn't really, like, heard from her, and she'd taken a break from Instagram and stuff.
Olivia:And then all of a sudden, yesterday, I had, like, about, like, 50 notifications, and she was, like, liking all of my videos. And she was, Instagram has not been showing me anything. You Right. Thing. Where can I buy your CD?
Olivia:Like, you know, and so it is it is just crazy because, like, you sometimes you actually might not even reach people. Like, you you might think you're annoying people, but you actually might not even be on people's feeds. You know?
Seth:Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Especially on social media. Yeah. That that I mean, because because, you know, for years, I've always seen people say, like, oh, I didn't even know that band had a new album out.
Seth:That's, like, some people's favorite albums. You know? Like, stuff does not stuff does not travel as far and as wide on social media as we think.
Olivia:Yeah. And I think it's also important to, like, you know and it's, like, I'm not really doing this a lot at the moment, but I need to remember to do it more is to, like like you said, it's, like, reintroduce the back catalog to people as well. You know? Mhmm. That's really important.
Seth:Yeah. So many yeah. I mean, we think yeah. Not everyone's a super mega fan or knows no one knows everything we do. I mean, someone just discovered Metallica's Black Album today and, like, has no idea of their thrash beginnings or their newer work.
Seth:Like, they have no idea. Someone listen to Led Zeppelin today for the first time.
Olivia:I know. And I love that so much. Like, because I I You know? Definitely had those experiences as well, you know, and it's like I've grown up with a lot of music that my parents listened to. I remember for so long thinking Bruce Springsteen and Brian Adams were the same guy and my parents were like, they're not the same.
Seth:Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Olivia:And then, like, I discovered Bruce Springsteen. I was like, wow. I didn't know if he did this. Like, I didn't know by, like, his first two albums and I only know, like, Born to Run and stuff and then you discover, like, The Wild Innocent and all that stuff. Like, oh my god.
Olivia:Like, totally different artist almost, you know?
Seth:And those are prolific, giant, like, press for for days kinda artists, and, like, here we are, a smaller independent artist, or writers, or photographers, whatever. No no one knows who we are.
Olivia:Like Yeah.
Seth:And the and the small bit that we that do know us, like, have no idea what we did a year ago.
Olivia:True. It it's so true. So, yeah, it's important not to just kinda be caught up in what's current. Like, you kinda do need to, like, sort of show your wares, you know, and show people the whole the whole picture. That's important.
Seth:Can we touch on a a quote from your post about your album?
Olivia:Yeah.
Seth:The Zoom call thing that you had with someone?
Olivia:Yeah. You mean the one where they told me I'd wasted years of my life.
Seth:You sat down on a Zoom call with someone in the industry who worked with Florence and the Machine and Ed Sheeran, told me not to release a concept album
Olivia:Oh, this person. Yes. Yeah.
Seth:Who would alienate new listeners. But anyone who says they they know the thing that the like, it's it's it's so hard to remember that as an art like like, people in that position, like, it it's so easy to forget you're dealing with artists, and it's art, and it's music. It's it's magic. It's it's it's and if you could figure it out, if there was a map, to borrow a Seth Godin term, like, everyone would have figured it out already and done it. And that's
Olivia:not Absolutely. And, like, you know, it's it's also you kinda have to look at, like, who's giving you advice and what their values are and, like, what kind of people they wanna work with. And, like, to be honest, that person, I think, now manages a friend of mine or, like, an acquaintance of mine. And she's she's she's a pop artist, you know, and and she's, like, in her early twenties and she's really following, like, the pop channel. She's like, I want to be the next Gracie Abrams, Taylor Swift, or whatever.
Olivia:And, you know, that is, like, advice that might be, like, pertinent to her. Whereas, like, that's not actually what I'm going for. And for me, you know, as much as, like, I like to write songs and perhaps there is, like, a thriller or joy to making something, you know, that people will really vibe with you. First of all, you can't entirely control that unless you have, like, a lot of money and marketing power behind you to put your stuff in front of people so many times that they, like, like it. You know?
Olivia:It's like songs on the radio being bombarded with, like, Dua Lipa all the time, so everyone loves Dua Lipa. You know? But at the same time, it's like, you will never be able to, like, sustain interest and passion in your project if you're doing it because someone else told you to do it, you know. And it's like, if if I didn't do the Geology album because I had, like, a collection of, like, songs that I play at gigs and stuff and I hadn't, like, recorded or anything. And I was like, should I, you know, do the songs or should I do the Geology songs?
Olivia:And, like, if I just did the songs, I I wouldn't have anything interesting to write in my newsletter. Like, I wouldn't have actually gotten funding because, like, the fur the first funding I got for this project was from the Geologist Association. You know, I wouldn't have played at, like, museums. I wouldn't have played Oxford Natural History Museum. I wouldn't have done a talk at the Geological Society.
Olivia:Like, I wouldn't have opened this whole world of, like, realizing that, like, art and science is important and, like, making art has real world effects. If I had done, you know, just done the Olivia Rafferty album with the songs by Olivia Rafferty and, like, put my face on the cover and was like, it's Olivia Rafferty. You know, it's like, maybe that'll happen sometime down the line. But to be honest, like, this actually does introduce who I am as an artist because I'm somebody who wants to write songs about, like, something that I find super so interesting that, like, people who are coming to my orbit can't help but be interested by it as well. You know?
Olivia:Like, that's the thing. Like, they have they they see, like, my enthusiasm for it. And whether they like geology or not, whether they care about rocks or, like, whatever they everyone's going, wow. You care so much about this. Like, I need to know more.
Olivia:I need to hear these songs. Like, what are you doing? Because I'm so excited. You know?
Seth:You that picture of you playing in front of the Tyrannosaurus Rex thing, that was what? Like, I that probably would not have happened if it was just like, oh, here's my my other songs. I'm playing a gig somewhere. Like, not many people get to have a photo of some of themselves playing in front of that. Like, that's amazing.
Olivia:And now I can say I open for TREC, which is a joke Oh, yeah. Made on the
Seth:That that right. They have multiple lanes there. Yeah. No. That's amazing.
Seth:Like, yeah, it's so in this world right now, like, you know, whenever the number is, by now, 80,000 songs uploaded to Spotify every day probably now or something like that. It's it's it's so like, good luck trying to differentiate and, like, trying to you know, with without having, like you said, that machine behind you, the marketing and the management and the this and the that, like, good luck. But to to do something with more focus. And and and two, it really speaks to, like, you were so into it. Like, you are so into it.
Seth:Yeah. So it's like, well, like, that that spread that emanates out of that. Like, you know, you're obviously stoked talking about it. Like, me talking about not being on social media. Like, I like, you're like, yes.
Seth:Let's go. Let's talk about this. Yeah. Yeah. That counts for so much.
Olivia:Yeah. You it's like you have to put fuel in your own engine. Like, you know, it's like you can't be fueled by external validation. Like, that works off until a certain point, and then you're kinda going, okay. But, like, what am I making?
Olivia:What am I doing? And I I've done that before, like, in different, like, lanes or things in my life where it's like, okay. I feel like I have to do this, so I'm gonna do it. You're not gonna be able to sustain the energy and the passion if you're not actually, like, feeding if, like, the art doesn't feed you first before it feeds, like, everyone else.
Seth:I'm sorry. I just wanna comment on on our pal, Alex, who's I don't know if you saw it. He said this is, like, when they put Batman and Superman in the same movie.
Olivia:Which which one is Batman and which one is Superman?
Seth:Yeah. I was hey. That's that's up for the audience to to figure that out, I guess. Right. Well, Yeah.
Seth:For those that don't know, Olivia did a Substack Live with Alex some time ago. Not that long ago, but and that was that was a bronchus.
Olivia:A lifetime. That that was the chaotic and unplanned. Like, this one is a little more structured.
Seth:A little more, but yeah. So I'd love to wrap up with just talking about new letters, talking about social media a bit, talking about, like, you know, getting away for like, is there is there any one thing intentional thing that you've done? I I I think you almost spoke of it of, like, you were really into this, and that's what that would it what's that one takeaway that someone could take from this as an artist, as a musician, or whatever their craft is? Like, how how do you think they could borrow from what you've done in this?
Olivia:I think, for me, like, a lot I don't know. Like, because the thing is, like, it it wasn't, like, an intentional choice to, like, write songs about a random subject. Like, it it was just sort of, like, I just wanted to do it. I think, like, what is really important though is, like, I think artists, like, and everyone do need to borrow from, like, different disciplines and stuff. Like, my desire to write these songs, you know, came from, like, a period of, like, real research and, like, investigation into, like, the nature of, like, time and what is the cons like, what is wasting time?
Olivia:What is long term time? Like, how does this make sense, like, in our lives as people? And it eventually led me to geology. But, you know, like, that was kind of me approaching, like, an album in a way that maybe not many artists, like, music artists would. They would normally be like, oh, I'm gonna write some songs about my life and, like, then kind of put them together where I was like, I wanna do this like an artist, like a visual artist or something.
Olivia:Or, you know, I really love when I get to the end of, like, reading novels, reading all the acknowledgments, and seeing, like, the different parts of, like, how novelists put their books together. And, like, one part of the process for me when I was making the album was having, like, beta listeners, which is, like, something that I kind of, you know, it's not gonna invent this, but, like, I picked it up from, like, authors having beta readers for their novels, you know. It's, people, like, who would who would read, you know, and give feedback and stuff, and that's what I did for, like, my album as well. And, like, even in terms of marketing and things, I just think there's so much you can do if you look outside of how people in your industry are making the thing that you're making. Like, if musicians don't just focus on, like, what other musicians are doing and how they're making music, if, like, subs like, people, like, on Substack who make newsletters, like, start to think, like, how could I make a newsletter in the way that, like, a ceramicist would, like, make a pot?
Olivia:You know? Like, just try and, like, recontextualize things. And, like, my recontextualization also took me into, like, a totally different, like, topic with, like, geology, and now I was being around scientists and stuff and, like, you know, playing museums, which is, like, not music venues at all. It's totally different, you know, and it's, like, the organization of it is different and, like, the paperwork is different, you know. But it's, like, it really just, I think, anything that kind of, like, widens your vision and experience, like, will strengthen you as an artist.
Olivia:So, like, don't like, it's really hard because, like, you wanna be insular because you feel like you're in competition with people in your industry. But if you start to kind of, like, spread out, like, laterally and think about what it is to be a creative person, you know, and, like, how other people do that regardless of what sort of media they work with, then it it it does strengthen you and makes you smarter, I think, and, like, more creative as well.
Seth:I love that. Olivia, thanks so much. That that's some great great input. Oh my goodness. Wow.
Seth:Yeah. I love that. Thank Absolutely. Thanks for doing this. Everybody, thanks for joining on a on a on a Monday afternoon here, you know, and on Substack Live.
Seth:So cool that you could be with us. Definitely go check out Olivia and go to her Substack, and and you'll be able to find all her music and all that good stuff. We're not talking about wrestling. Like cowboy. That's that's another one.
Seth:That's we'll tune into that Substack live later. So thanks again, everybody, for being here. Thank you. Have a great rest of your day. Bye, everyone.
Olivia:Bye. Bye.
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